A few comments from a new user:

What would be most useful to me would be to be using an approach plate, swith to the notepad to copy a clearance and then return directly to the plate I was using--a sort of back-to-bookmark function. As it is, I seem to have to go to the Notes section, then back to the Docs section and go down through this section (including entering the airport identifier again!) all the way to get back to the plate. Is this, or could this "bookmark" be possible? I find nothing in the documentation.

Another question: There are a lot of UI interface inconsistencies (re use of buttons vs. stylus, etc.), many of them mentioned on this forum. But is someone *systematically* keeping track of them for correction?

The enroute charts look completely unusable to me. Not only are they impossible to navigate, but much of the data is obscured, including lots of MEAs, etc. I know there are plans to improve navigation and zooming, but the legibility will have to be dramatically improved.

I won't even mention the AIM/FAR debacle.

I think this whole system holds great promise and I'd like to be supportive of the developers. But, at the moment, I can't even imagine using this thing in the cockpit, except maybe parked on the ramp. The interface seems way to cumbersome, inconsistent and unreliable.

Thanks,
Walt

As you say, it holds great promise. I find it valuable as is - although I am anxious for improvements.

There are a couple of appoaches to switching between multiple tasks - switching between simultaneously running applications or every application supports bookmarking so that launching it seamlessly gets you back to where you were.

Both would require changes to the underlying operating system - which myairplane.com doesn't control. The same capability has been discussed on the iRex Forum.

It sounds like you are saying that until you can manage all your cockpit chores using this device, it is of questionable value. While I find note taking to be intriguing, just using it as a replacement for approach charts is enough for me.

I have been using JeppView and printing a fair number of charts for every flight. Origin, Destination, Official Alternate, a few key intermediate airports, a few airports in other key locations that I might find myself diverting to in case I have to go around some weather...

With the eFB in the cockpit, I now print origin and destination. Done. When I have enough confidence in the stability of the iLiad, I probably won't print anything.

By the way, I haven't seen any stability problems with the eFB application. Some of the very obvious stability issues have been in the underlying iLiad and iRex is fixing those fast. The double-tap crash was my favorite. That is one that never should have gotten by the development team, much less any kind of testing group.

Anyway, I guess my point is that if you look at what this device could do, it is a long way from being mature. I look at it from what it does do and it has a reserved seat in my airplane right next to my tri-fold kneeboard with scratch paper.

By the way, I did not mean to imply that a bookmark capability would not be a useful feature in the eFB application.

As it is, other viewers use the manifest files to remember where they were in each of the respective documents. The quick access buttons (Docs, Notes, Books, Newspapers) remember which document was open. These two levels make it easy (but not quick) to jump around. Two pushes of the Notes button and you are back to the notes page where you left off. Two pushes of the Books button and you are back to the page your were last reading. Two pushes of the Docs button gets you back to the page that you were last reading in a doc (except for the eFB application).

Bookmarking might be a good idea for the trip folder concept.

The way that I organize my paper charts is to have charts that I might use in alpha order with plastic dividers stuck in for the charts that I expect to use. Usually, just two dividers - the origin and the destination. Sometimes a third for an alternate. Clear is my checklist. Orange is the origin. Green is the destination. Red is the alternate.

I move the dividers around as necessary so that the Orange divider moves from the origin taxi diagram to the probable approach chart at the origin for a return just prior to takeoff. The Green divider moves from the front of the destination to the chosen approach to the taxi diagram. The Red one stays at the front of the alternate (which I have never had to use). Only when I am pretty sure of the approach will I pull it out of my snap ring binder and clip it to the yolk or my kneeboard.

I can flip back and forth from my checklist (The clear divider) and the approach divider (probably Green). I can close the whole thing up and with one flip to a particular colored divider, be back to where I was.

Applying this to the eFB - We don't really need a subset of airports. The trip folder could just be a list of bookmarks. When looking at a chart (any chart) the user can request that a bookmark be set. The user could choose to replace an existing bookmark or create a new one.

Using the flipper bar to page goes just one chart forward or back in the city/airport/category/chart alpha ordered list (including the repeated supplemental pages). Using the flipper bar to long-press page goes forward or back to the next bookmark in the same ordered sequence.

Backing out of the chart goes to the chart category selection for whatever airport you happen to be in. You can dive back to a particular category and then specific chart. Paging can resume from there. That is why I thought bookmarks should page in city/name sequence. This best simulates having a book of charts open to a chart in between two bookmarks.

So, in my pre-flight planning, I can search for and bookmark the origin, destination, alternate and maybe a few others. I would probably bookmark the airport diagram and the likley approach chart. Then, I can navigate to the taxi diagram for the origin and power down.

In the plane, I can power up. "Notes. Notes" and I'm looking at my checklist. "Docs. Docs" and I am back in the eFB application snapping to the last viewed chart which is the taxi diagram.

Prior to take off, I can page to find the approach for an emergency return at the origin. "Notes. Notes" and I continue with my checklist through cruise or, should it be necessary, "Docs, Docs" and I'm looking at the return approach.

After takeoff, during cruise, "Docs. Docs" and I can long-press page to find my bookmark for the destination and power down.

Maybe I use the eFB for checklist during cruise and prior to descent. Once descending, I am going to get it set up for the destination and leave it there - paging between the airport diagram and the desired approach.

Clear of the runway at the destination, I can page back to the airport diagram (either taking the time to single page back or, more likely, long-press page to the bookmark I left there).

Should I have to divert, the alternate is just a couple of long-press page turns away.

The top level entry for the eFB would need to provide access to searching for an airport or the list of bookmarks in the trip folder. Multiple sets of bookmarks might be a possibility. Being able to delete individual bookmarks or clear them all would need to be supported.

Just my thoughts.

Geez! I love the possibiilties of this thing...

Travis-

Thanks for your thoughts--I'm mulling over them. Yes, I was thinking of this replacing my knee board, which is basically just a clearance pad, plates and checklists (I accept separate enroutes). The eFly is pretty close to being able to do that--but not quite. And not quite in an airplane isn't too good in my experience.

I'll give your ideas some thought.

Incidentally, if I could just get the checklist and notepad links to appear in the eFlyBook main screen (along with AFD, U.S. Terminal Procedures, IFR enroute and FAR/AIM links) I'd consider this almost accomplished. With that, you wouldn't have to reenter the identifier to get back to an approach plate after going to either of the other two.

Thanks,
Walt

Something in your comments leads me to believe that you are not aware of what the shortcut buttons on the iLiad are already capable of. Forgive me, if I am telling you something you already know...

At the moment, there is no technical difference between switching to another application from within the eFB application and using the iLiad shortcut buttons to do it external to the eFB. Currently, the underlying device drivers in the iLiad do not support running more than one application at a time.

If they did allow multiple applications, then you could launch the eFB and navigate to a chart. Leave it running and switch to a viewer for your checklist. Leave that running and switch to the scribble viewer for taking notes. With this capability, a switcher would have to be part of the iLiad base user interface.

This has been mentioned in the iRex Forum but I seriously doubt that it will go that route with this hardware. I'm sure someone will hack it so that it can do it but I don't know that I would want to live with the consequences.

However, even without that, the four shortcut buttons on the iLiad already remember which document was open in that particular area last. And, since the last read page for each document or note page is also remembered, you have a two-press shortcut to four different documents.

Press "Notes" twice and it will jump back to whatever page in whatever document you were looking at in the Notes directory. Same for "Books," "News" and "Docs."

By the way, PDF, HTML, JPG, and BMP files can go where you want. You don't have to have notes in the Notes directory, and just docs in the other directories.

These switches take less than 10 seconds. First press - about 4 seconds to close the current application and open up the new directory. Second press - 3 to 6 seconds to open the new application and get to the last read page.

Trip folder and bookmarking aside, there are two gotchas that myairplane.com could solve and we would have a very big advancement in usability. 1) The current launching of eFB from the Docs directory doesn't count as a document for the shortcut key. Press "Docs" twice and it will put you back into the document you were reading in the Docs directory even if eFB was the last virtual document you opened. And 2) the eFB application needs to snap to the last viewed chart.